The Kingdom of the Emerald Hills

Look Mr. Politician…
If you had bothered to read what I wrote perhaps you might understand or comprehend exactly what was said.
I’ll slow it down for your little pea brain to absorb what was presented.
Try and keep up this time, will you.

I was told that “TWO KNIGHTS” (count them ONE, TWO)
Two Knights had brought the proposal to King B…
This would indicate one of two things… There were TWO KNIGHTS or B was lying.
Which was it Forest?
Or… are you simply lying now to make yourself look good *AGAIN!

Manipulation of the Knights Circle has been done before, perhaps it was before your time. Trades have been made… “we agree to knight player X if you’ll agree to knight player Y” Manipulation at its finest.

Your sarcastic way of saying that very few knights have stepped up to argue these points may be correct, but you seem to be completely ignoring the knights and non-knights who have. Ya just keep chipping away at DA and myself. You seem to take the silence of those just reading and not posting as some kind of approval…

I guess if the paperwork ever gets sent out to the Park PMs and this sham of an Althing gets voted up or down, then we’ll all know what to do next.

My advise to our players…
Watch for underhanded deals made behind closed doors for future favors and such.
Wouldn’t be the first time…
So, make sure to tally your votes YOURSELVES and make copies to keep for proof of the results.

Just sayin’



PS. Thank You Aria for that lesson in simple math, perhaps Mr. Politician will pick up on it.
Thanks to ThreeJugs for posting the info on what will happen to the landgrants if this BS is passed.

The Kingdom will continue to recognize land grants. In addition, the PM can award credits for work on the land as approved participation at Amtgard (see the credit list in the corpora).

And Delphos, thanks for proving my point. There may have been underhanded things in the circle before I was there. But since then we have put in by laws and procedures to make sure it didn't happen anymore. So the circle is a much better group than it was (according to you).

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Forest Evergreen

Puppet Master of the EH

"Of course you are Forest. You're like the Mr. Burns of EH." - Finn

(insert titles and awards here)

Umm Forest I believe you need to check the terms of TWF lease. Amtgard has no rights to sublet the land in any shape or form with out land owners permission. Well I think Threejugs post says you won't have land owners permission

Artia, how is that a sublease? A land grant is simply allowing certain groups to use specific camping spots. That is an in game issue that was handled by the RGK. It can now be handled by the monarchy.

Lets get realistic. The RGK has been dead for years. Three Jugs is the driving force at the land. I hope she will continue to promote land improvements. but to say that the RGK has been functioning as a group is just not true. It has been certain individuals (3 Juggs, Sutra, Shamus) who have made things happen.

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Forest Evergreen

Puppet Master of the EH

"Of course you are Forest. You're like the Mr. Burns of EH." - Finn

(insert titles and awards here)

Land grant would be considered assigning a part of TWF. Would also be considered lending a part of it.

RGK is no different from any other office in this kingdom. How many times have we had BOD members, Champions, even Monarch that take office then go don't do anything. With that reasoning you should do away with all office position

And the name is ARIA not Artia

Then we are screwed. We have alrady assigned a trench field, a knight's circle, a bardic area, the Tavern, and a feast area.

OH WAIT...it says to assign transfer of pledge the lease!! Well, since no land grants involve giving or assigning any part of the lease, then i think we are safe.

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Forest Evergreen

Puppet Master of the EH

"Of course you are Forest. You're like the Mr. Burns of EH." - Finn

(insert titles and awards here)

You are assigning a portion of the lease in order to give these land grants. Cause that is giving use of that land to only select individuals

No. We do not assign the lease to anyone. We allow certain areas to be used by certain groups. We do that now. The RGK has no bearing on the lease. So with or without the RGK we can assign land grants.

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Forest Evergreen

Puppet Master of the EH

"Of course you are Forest. You're like the Mr. Burns of EH." - Finn

(insert titles and awards here)

Your right there with or without the RGK you can assign land grants but only with the land pwners permission. Since the land owner is head of the RGK, RGK can give permission. Without the RGK you have to have owner permission and she has already said that wont happen

But here let me break this down for you.

sublease n. the lease of all or a portion of premises by a tenant who has leased the premises from the owner

lease -a contract renting land, buildings, etc., to another; a contract or instrument conveying property to another for a specified period or for a period determinable at the will of either lessor or lessee in consideration of rent or other compensation.

assign - to give or allocate; allot: to assign rooms at a hotel.

A land grant is a contract with the company/household saying the company/household will be given an assigned piece of the land for personal use in return for rent (in this case via land hours). Since Amtard is the leasee when it comes to TWF this agreement would considered a sublease. By the terms of the lease agreement with the land owners this type of agreement is not allowed unless they have written permission from the land owner

The Green Dragons have a land grant. We have never signed a contract.

There is nothing in the lease that says we can not assign portion of the land for certain groups during our events. I am not sure why you see it otherwise. The EH leases the land. What we do with it within our own group during the time we use it is up to us.

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Forest Evergreen

Puppet Master of the EH

"Of course you are Forest. You're like the Mr. Burns of EH." - Finn

(insert titles and awards here)

What Forest, in his arrogance or idiocy, doesn’t seem to comprehend, is that the RGK is the liaison between the Kingdom and the Land Owner. The Monarchy has little or nothing to do with how the land is divided. That is the sole decision of the Land Owner who chairs the RGK. The King can’t give you land hours, land grants or set aside any portion of the property without the approval of the Land Owner. That would be subleasing, which can only be done by the Land Owner not by the Kingdom.
Read it again…

Once the RGK is taken away from us, there will be NO LAND HOURS and NO LAND GRANTS, making ALL CAMPING SPOTS AT TANGLEWOOD FOREST OPEN FOR PUBLIC CAMPING. This will include the areas currently taken by the Corsairs, Sable Pride, Wolf Pack and any other groups who have spent many long hours in both clearing and upkeep of their camping areas.

ThreeJugs can decide to put anyone or anything Anywhere she wants…
That could include a giant widget, smack dab in the middle of the trench field or the battle field or an entire family camping in Green Dragon, Sable Pride, or Corsair camp.

All the work that Luna Lobos have put into their land could be completely destroyed in one weekend by someone camping there that just didn’t care.

Credits don’t mean a thing when it comes to how much work some people have put into “their” land.

I have to ask myself… why would the King want to control Tanglewood Forest?
Or is that even the reason for such a movement to eliminate the RGK?
This is but one of those “consequences” I mentioned earlier on this corpora re-write issue.

Having no official ballot and therefore no way to tract and verify the votes should prove interesting as well…

IMHO… the combined goal of this re-write and Version 8.0 are designed to bring down the foundations of the Emerald Hills… once and for all.
To create a completely different game and yet keep the name “Amtgard”.
That way the overall number of existing players will remain high and they won’t have to start at ground level to build another LARP.

Just sayin’

PLEASE check your paperwork. In order to have a LAND GRANT you must have the PAPERWORK ON FILE FOR SUCH LAND GRANT WITH THE RGK, with by the way HAS to be approved by the landowner and the RGK before they are approved. Those papers are separate from the lease that is with the EH for the land as a whole and is a separate entity in itself with you and your household and/or company with consideration that the proper work hours are completed to earn said land grant, and proper work hours are completed to keep said land grant.

For those of you who don't understand what's going on here, Forest has been trying to kill the RGK for years. Every few years he either takes the office of king (or some upper kinda stick your nose up there kinda office) and prepares battles to 'Officially Kill the RGK'. I saw it coming the second he announced that he was running for this term of office, but there was nothing that we could do about it but sit and wait for the shit to hit the fan. That is why McFadden has washed his hands of it all. He is tired of Forest's crap.

Here's what Forest is trying to get done in the long run folks....
First of all he's trying to get the RGK killed. That would kill most if not all of the spirited work done at the land. That would start to kill the populous coming out for there would be less and less new stuff at the land to draw people to the game. Eventually he is trying to get us to stop coming ALLLLLL the way out to Tanglewood Forest and start using some place closer to Dallas to camp for the EH Events. Eventhough McFadden went out of his way and has spend tons of money on this place JUST so the SO oculd HAVE a place to gather. Did you know that that was the only reason that McFadden bought this land in the first place? He was looking for some land for the EH to use for their events and camping.

YOU PEOPLE ARE THE REASON THAT TANGLEWOOD EXISTS! WHY ARE YOU LETTING FOREST SCREW IT UP?

Here's the low down. One way or another, whether this thing passes or not. Whether Amtgard eventually uses Tanglewood Forest or choses to leave and go somewhere else.... Tanglewood Forest will still be here. McFadden & I will still be here. It just won't be as much fun without you guys.

Hell, I'll run a fence around the place and put horses on it. That's Dave's plan in the long run anyway for when there's no events going on.

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Samantha Three Jugs
(aka: Susan Hall, the crazy lady that lives at Tanglewood Forest)

P.S. ~ Don't piss off a lady that has a knife and rifle target in her backyard.

Rendezvous'rs are just kids with really BIG playgrounds....and black powder toys that go BOOM!

One more thing....Please remember. As land owners, we make NO MONEY for the EH using the land. The Lease Payment that the EH pays for use of the land is only a very small portion of our land taxes. In fact, when the EH was having financial troubles, McFadden was kind enough to even LOWER your lease rate by almost 1/2 of what it formerly was. Then I came along and made sure to get us Agriculture status, making the land taxes 1/4 of what they were, lowering your lease bill to an even LOWER bill.

We do this because we are trying to make sure that the EH has a nice place to hold it's events.
We care about it's people. Although it seems that there are some that would rather see me outta the picture.

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Samantha Three Jugs
(aka: Susan Hall, the crazy lady that lives at Tanglewood Forest)

P.S. ~ Don't piss off a lady that has a knife and rifle target in her backyard.

Rendezvous'rs are just kids with really BIG playgrounds....and black powder toys that go BOOM!

I'm not active, and I haven't been for some time, but I do still read and keep up with you guys, and now that I've remembered my password, it's nice to converse with you guys again! :) As a former EHPM, I was involved in Corpora changes myself. I felt then, as I do now, that our current Corpora has a lot of evolving to do to become that elusive "perfect document". Yes, a complete re-write is long over due. It is my opinion that a lot of these changes are all individually something that need to be addressed. Collectively; however, voting this Corpora in is a bad, bad idea. There are so many pages in this thread so I may have missed this, but is this an "all or nothing" vote or is each grouping of changes being voted on separately?

I have some working opinions on some of the changes proposed, but I want to address one simple one: RGK. The problem with the RGK is not that they don't meet and they don't do anything. The problem I saw when I was in office was that there are a lot of members of this Kingdom who don't really have a working understanding of what the RGK does. (myself included) There is probably an entire generation of players who don't have a clue what the importance of the RGK is. I have learned some things over the years from talking to people who have held RGK positions, and I think if given some more attention the interest in this important aspect of our Kingdom would flourish. I think it's a dangerous thing to just go and disolve the entire thing.

So if I was eligible to vote, and if this is an all-or-nothing vote, I would have to vote NO on the whole thing just because of the RGK issue.

And one more opinion... as for the CoK, I believe you should be held to a higher standard in this Kingdom if you are going to wear that white belt. Note though, that the Knights in this kingdom are held to the same voting eligibility requirements in all kingdom elections as any other populous member. They are held to a higher voting requirement when voting in the CoK only. It is my opinion that any changes in voting requirements for Kinghts be addressed by the CoK and not by a Kingdom vote. The EH trusts the Knights to run their Circle and we should never get involved in their business.

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Lady Carmony

I am glad you acknowledge that last point, although you do not acknowledge it makes you wrong.



What you are proposing changes nothing. The Monach and PM can still, at will, suspend all or part of the Corpora.

As far as Tanglewood and sub-leases, I don't feel qualified to offer my opinion. That sounds like a lawyerly topic. However, I know that if the Kingdom enters open conflict with the landowner, that's game over for continued use of the land. If the RGK is to be abolished, and the Kingdom has an ongoing interest in using the land, and the landowner is insisting on the continuation of the RGK, then... I think the Kingdom needs to be negotiating a new approach with the landowner before revising the Corpora.



The CoK is ultimately an alumni organization, and should have authority over nothing other than its own opinion. In particular, the CoK should not be continuously in charge of who counts as a knight, whether the issue is their extraordinary attendance, an impeachment of someone's duly earned belt, or deciding the legitimacy of a knighthood bestowed with or without their approval. All that has been asked of the Circle is their advice, yet over time, the Circle has come to see itself as the gatekeepers of knighthood itself.

The Monarch's job is to make an informed decision; hopefully the populace have elected a person of judgment. The Circle's purpose is to impart a sense to the Monarch. Knighthood should not devolve to a popularity poll among the current knights. The Monarch has a responsibility to refresh the Circle with new blood, if need be.

If the EH wants to stay out of knights business, so be it. Do one thing: don't foist a removal process on the CoK. I can think of nothing more potentially destructive to the fellowship of that body.